- 1 Çhengaghyn elley yn ard-ghuillag
- 2 Cummey ny h-ard-ghuillag
- 3 Small request
- 4 Plan dy chooid y Celtic League bentyn rish Wikipedia
- 5 Survey on this wikipedia
- 6 Yn fo-linney
- 7 Translation
- 8 What this language?
- 9 Missing Manx
- 10 Celtic and Indigenous Languages Conference
- 11 Yn Chiangley ta gra Ellan Vannin
Çhengaghyn elley yn ard-ghuillag[edit source]
Nagh beagh eh ny share çhengaghyn elley dy chur er yn ard-ghuillag 'sy chiangley ayns çhengaghyn elly? --MacTire02 18:23, 2 Mean Fouyir 2008 (UTC)
- Jeant ec MacTire. -- Shimmin Beg 18:01, 31 Jerrey Geuree 2009 (UTC)
Cummey ny h-ard-ghuillag[edit source]
Va mee smooinaghtyn er çhyndaa ny h-ard-ghuilag as ta daa chummey jeant aym. Ta'n chied chummey bunnit er y lhiaggan Yernish as t'eh ry-gheddyn ayns shoh. Ta'n nah chummey bunnit er y lhiaggan t'ain agh lesh çhyndaaghyn ennagh ayn as t'eh ry-gheddyn in ayns shoh. Ren mee ny cummaghyn shoh er y fa nagh vel artyn noa er yn ard-ghuillag femoil ain ny smoo as er y fa dy vel drogh-ghrammadeys ayn. Cre er lhiat, Himmin? --MacTire02 12:41, 2 Jerrey Geuree 2009 (UTC)
- Jeant ec MacTire. Ta'n cummey noa ayn nish -- Shimmin Beg 18:01, 31 Jerrey Geuree 2009 (UTC)
Small request[edit source]
Hello! I am a Polish wikipedian and I would like to ask you for your help - writing a new article about former Polish President who won the Nobel Peace Prize in 1983 – Lech Wałęsa. I have looked for his biography in your Wikipedia but without success. Polish Wikipedians will be grateful for your help. Thank you so much in advance! PS you can find the English version of the article here. Best wishes from Poland, Patrol110 22:11, 28 Jerrey Fouyir 2009 (UTC)
- Em...the article is already located here. The article has been on this wikipedia for over a month now. --MacTire02 23:04, 28 Jerrey Fouyir 2009 (UTC)
Plan dy chooid y Celtic League bentyn rish Wikipedia[edit source]
Survey on this wikipedia[edit source]
Hi, I'm sorry, but I cannot speak Manx. I therefore write in English, if it is okay. I am from Germany, Bremen, and I am studying linguistics and I have a seminar on language ausbau. This is, when a language doesn't have enough words to express all the modern things and it gets then upgrated with new expressions to fulfill it. And I want to study how Wikipedia can help on that and this is why I doing those surveys. I have two questions for you: 1. What do you think is the contribution of Wikipedia that your languages gets beter developped and gets new expressions for modern things, 2. How do you build new words, are there certain patterns or methods? (And would you be so kind and show me, where you are discussing on new words?) I would be really thankful, if there came some meanings and answers together. Thank you very much, Sincerely Zylbath 16:59, 13 Mean Fouyir 2011 (UTC)
- Hi Zylbath, and greetings from the Manx Wikipedia community! I must apologise but I'm not entirely sure what you are trying to say for the first question. Can you rephrase it in some other way, please? Regarding the second question - the link Wikipedia:Termeeaght might be of use for you along with its accompanying talk page. Generally speaking, when coming up with new terms (although Coonceil ny Gaelgey ("Manx Language Council") is quite good and up to date with much terminology) we try to stick with the existing Gaelic languages of Irish and Scottish Gaelic. In many cases we simply borrow the word from, say, Irish and apply Manx phonological and morphological rules to get a new Manx word. In some cases we simply break the word down into its respective components (generally words from Latin or Greek) and "translate" the component parts. Sometimes we simply borrow a word from English and "Gaelicize" the word. And sometimes still we simply try to use an old Manx word by extending its meaning. I hope this helps. If you can clarify question 1 I will try answer it as well. Kind regards, Mac Tíre Cowag 18:36, 13 Mean Fouyir 2011 (UTC)
- Hi, thank you very much for your answer. That really helped a lot. By the first question I ment, whether Wikipedia has a part in making the language's vocabulary more modern, so that you find words for the scientific domains for example. Do you see there a possibility that Wikipedia plays a role in the language development and modernization of the Welsh language? Zylbath 20:02, 13 Mean Fouyir 2011 (UTC)
- I think Wikipedia does have a part to play. Minority languages have a problem in that there are not enough people who speak that particular language to enable a speaker have a specialised conversation in a particular field of study. Generally speaking, when speakers of these minority languages gather together, at social gatherings for instance, the speakers tend to converse on topics that are common to all speakers, such as traditional music, stories, life in general. There is no real outlet for specialised conversation such as on topics like physics, linguistics, biology, chemistry, astronomy, etc. Wikipedia provides that outlet. Even if there is no actual conversation taking place the speaker feels they are able to use their language skills while at the same time focussing on a topic that is of a more particular interest to them. I think the part Wikipedia has to play in the development of vocabulary is that it suddenly means the speaker is confronted with having to coin a new term or reappropriate an older term for use with a newer meaning. I see Wikipedia as being the newest stage in digital media that is affecting language modernisation, with mail-lists and e-mail lists having existed previously (and in some cases continuing to exist alongside other fora). I hope this helps. If you have any other questions please feel free to ask. Regards, Mac Tíre Cowag 21:20, 13 Mean Fouyir 2011 (UTC)
- Servus, Zylbath! I've studied linguistics so am very happy to help. You can drop me a German message on my talk page if necessary. As MacTire has said, Coonceil ny Gaelgey works hard to produce new vocabulary. I think one notable feature compared to some language authorities (Academie français?) is that as we are a minority language, the Coonceil mostly focuses on everyday terminology for ordinary use, rather than technical terminology. As a result, we on Wikipedia end up creating a lot of vocabulary for the technical terms we often need in articles, though we might replace it with approved vocab from CnG later. On the other hand, sometimes they approve our terminology.
- 1. As MacTire has said, one of the main contributions of Wikipedia is that it allows us to write about a specific topic that aren't generally discussed in Manx. I don't think many people really discuss cells in Manx, for example, and there isn't a body of existing agreed vocabulary to do that. I don't think I would have much chance of starting that conversation in a pub. However, someone can sit down and write an article about anything that they find important or interesting. They are then forced to either borrow or create vocabulary for the things they need to express.
- Of course, I could write an essay in Manx and put it anywhere on the internet (and sometimes I do), and create the new vocabulary I need. However, an important thing that Wikipedia does is lead to negotiation of vocabulary. I don't just create a word that suits me; other users will provide advice or criticism, and we are encouraged to discuss new terminology before we use it. This means we end up with a more consistent set of vocabulary, and that different writers use the same terminology. If we were all just writing on our own websites, we might all be using different terminology for the same thing. Once the terminology is available on a commonly-used website, there is a set of vocabulary out there for people to use if they want to discuss the subject. Of course, people might not agree with the terms we use, but they are a starting point.
- Wikipedia is also a structured environment, with categories and links. This means it is easy to link Manx meanings to those in other languages, and to relate terms to each other, whereas if used only on a personal website or in a book, they are more isolated.
- 2. I think the way we construct new words depends on the new vocabulary we need. You can see some examples of this in our Manual of Style (I've linked the English version). Here are some examples:
- Town names are normally borrowed from the local language.
- Some relatively common words have an Irish or Scottish Gaelic term, but no Manx one. For example, "orientation" (Orientierung?) is "treoshuíomh" in Irish, but in Manx there's no evidence of a specific term (people would probably just have used a phrase to get that meaning across). To translate de:Varietät (Linguistik) I took the Irish components (treo & suíomh) and exchanged them for the Manx equivalents. In other cases we might just transcribe a word using the Manx orthography: "Nastey co-ioosagh" (kovalente Bindung) is from Irish "nasc comhfhiúsach", where "Nastey"="Nasc", "co-"="comh" and the rest is just transcribed.
- There are also technical words with a handy Gaelic equivalent: bineal (guttation) is based on Irish "braonaíl", where "braon" (droplet) is the same as Manx "bine".
- For technical and scientific terms, Irish has a tendency to transliterate Greek terms that are used in other languages. Manx is more likely to translate the words, which means the Manx term is easy to understand, but has no obvious link to other languages. So Irish "geolaíocht" is Manx "creg-oaylleeaght" (geology) for example. Because of this trait of Manx, I tend to avoid just transliterating the Irish term, as it would not fit the historical habits of Manx.
- Manx is very good at changing word type (like German), so creating derived terms is easy and logical. You can usually add -agh to create an adjective from a noun. You can change -agh to -aght to create a noun from an adjective. You can add -al or -aghey to create a verb (like -en in German), or -aght or -aghys for a noun (like -ung). So "ammys" (respect, homage) gives "ammyssagh" (respectful, admiring) and "ammyssaght" (obsequiousness) and "ammyssaghey" (to pay homage). You can also use many adjectives as a noun meaning "person or thing with this property", so "ammyssagh" means a obsequious person, "fishigagh" means physics or a physicist. Those are less cases of creating new vocabulary, and more like just stretching the words we already have.
- Some vocabulary comes in sets. For example, fields of study in English tend to use -ology with a Greek version of the subject, giving "zoology, anthropology, sociology". A few Manx sciences have names transcribed from English or Greek, but most use a Manx term + oaylleeaght ("science"). For a field without an existing Manx name, it's easy to follow this pattern to produce fliughane-oaylleeaght (mycology), or shellane-oaylleeaght (apiology). It also means we end up with a set of vocabulary that's consistent (so easy for others to expand) and transparent (so easy to understand at first glance).
- Otherwise, I would look for ways to combine existing words into a phrase, or expand the meaning of an existing Manx word. So "faggyssaght" (approximation) was stretched to cover "approximant" (in phonetics), and "inçhynaght" (intelligence) was adapted into "far-inçhynaght" (artificial intelligence). Manx has lots of affixes we can use for this: far- for "false", "so-" for "-able", co- for "together" or "mutual", do- for "not able" (un- -able), sheer- for "permanently", -ish for a language... Again, I try to make sure the meaning of a word is reasonably obvious.
- Sometimes a word doesn't seem to fit any of those categories, and there is no Gaelic equivalent. Then I'd look at the actual meaning of the original word (in whichever language) and how different languages created the vocabulary. I would start with other Celtic languages, but also consider German (because it is good at building words from others) and perhaps others, as well as the English. This helps avoid just translating an English word that doesn't have a relevant meaning in Manx. For example, the English linguistic term "hedge" (Heckenausdruck) doesn't have the same metaphorical meaning in Manx, which I think comes from "hedging one's bets" in English. So I used "shaghney", which means "evade, shirk, shun, dodge" to convey the same idea.
- I hope this helps. Let me know if you have any more questions. -- Shimmin Beg 10:37, 14 Mean Fouyir 2011 (UTC)
- This is a very poor way to create new words. If you want new words, consult a native speaker (failing that, a local), who can tell you what word is used (in the example of 'covalent bond' there was already a correct term, for example). In the unlikely circumstance that the native speaker has no idea what they would say, then I recommend using a phrase. The creation of new terms should not be simply a matter of calquing. The Manx which is spoken now has its own ways of word creation, and wikipedia will just cause chaos if it is the source of new words (it is not used, and nobody will know about them, for a start). Duplication of terminology is to be avoided - Manx does not need two names for covalent bonding. dq Loayr 21:05, 31 Jerrey Fouyir 2014 (UTC)
- In addition to this, there is a multiplicity of work on biology available in Manx and we do discuss cells dq Loayr 21:09, 31 Jerrey Fouyir 2014 (UTC)
Yn fo-linney[edit source]
Ta'n fo-linney jeh Wikipedia ayns Gaelg, "Y chicklipaid heyr". Ta "seyr" çheet er free, agh ta "nastee" çheet er "free (from cost)". Vel "Y chicklipaid nastee" ny smoo resoonagh?Donal Mac Phaayl 14:01, 13 Mean Souree 2013 (UTC)
- Agh, cha nel y "free" 'sy chooish shoh cheet er leagh ny prios ny lomarcan! T'eh cheet er yn aght dy vel peiagh erbee abyl cur rish y chalee (marish, ny gyn, loggal stiagh); cha nel kied jeeragh ry-laccal y stoo t'ayn y choipal; ta'n chicklipaid seyr veih imneaghyn politickagh, crauee, a.r.e. Mac Tíre Cowag 16:29, 14 Mean Souree 2013 (UTC)
Hello, I asked on your "Manx language" article ("Gailg" or something like that), but I guess here are more people to read my question.
I wonder if you could translate the 2nd article of the Human Rights Declaration into Manx. I'd be very pleased if someone could do that. That's the original text: Everyone is entitled to all the rights and freedoms set forth in this declaration, without distinction of any kind, such as race, colour, sex, language, religion, political or other opinion, national or social origin, property, birth or other status. Furthermore, no distinction shall be made on the basis of the political, jurisdictional or international status of the country or territory to which a person belongs, whether it be independent, trust, non-self-governing or under any other limitation of sovereignty. You see, it's not very long and I guess every Manx speaker is also speaking English, so I'd appreciate if you could to me that favour.--188.8.131.52 03:35, 30 Jerrey Souree 2013 (UTC)
What this language?[edit source]
Missing Manx[edit source]
Manx is missing from this page: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/There_is_also_a_Wikipedia_in_your_language
Cheers, Varlaam (talk) 03:45, 19 Jerrey Geuree 2016 (UTC)
Celtic and Indigenous Languages Conference[edit source]
Dear colleagues, The first ‘Celtic Knot’ – Wikipedia Language Conference will take place 5 & 6 July 2017 at the University of Edinburgh in collaboration with Wikimedia UK. Please save the date. The event will focus on Celtic Languages and Indigenous Languages, showcasing innovative approaches to open education, open knowledge and open data that support and grow language communities. The call for ideas closes on 10th March 2017. Our vision is for diverse participants working in Celtic and Indigenous languages ranging from Wikimedians, educators, researchers, information professionals, media professionals, linguists, translators, learning technologists and more coming together to share good practice and find fruitful new collaborations to support language communities as a result of the event. To find out more about the conference themes and the format of sessions please visit the Celtic Knot page. Email your session proposal to email@example.com indicating the session type by no later than Friday 10th March. Please feel free to forward this event to interested colleagues in your network. If you would like to more then please contact me direct at firstname.lastname@example.org Very best regards, Stinglehammer (talk) 23:27, 23 Toshiaght Arree 2017 (UTC)
Yn Chiangley ta gra Ellan Vannin[edit source]
Er lhiam's dy voddym gra gyn ginsh breag erbee dy vel yn chooid smoo dy Ghaelgeyryn coontey 'Ellan Vannin' dy ve ny sampleyr jeh Baarlaghys. Cha nel mee rieau er chlashtyn Gaelgeyr flaaoil erbee jannoo ymmyd jeh'n ennym shen. Ny yei shen, ta kiangley er yn ard-ghuillag jeh nane jeh ny ynrickan ynnydyn-echey ta dy bollagh ayns Gaelg as yn ennym shen er.
Er lhiam pene dy lhisagh shoh ve caghlaait, myr va ennym yn art, dys 'Mannin', son dy re shen yn ennym ta Gaelgeyryn jannoo ymmyd jee son y chooid smoo.